# Observations stuck at genus level after taxon swap **URL:** \ **Category:** General\ **Created:** [September 1, 2023, 12:16pm UTC](https://forum.inaturalist.org/t/observations-stuck-at-genus-level-after-taxon-swap/44797 "2023-09-01T12:16:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 7\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![atronoxychump](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.inaturalist.org/atronoxychump/32/9923_2.png) [@atronoxychump](https://forum.inaturalist.org/u/atronoxychump)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 12:16pm UTC](https://forum.inaturalist.org/t/observations-stuck-at-genus-level-after-taxon-swap/44797/1 "2023-09-01T12:16:34Z")
Not sure if this problem has been addressed before, but the kind of situation i’m concerned with is this: “_Gen. A sp. B_” has been swapped to “_Gen. C sp. B_”. Observations with ID of “_Gen. C_” (generic level) _after_ an initial ID of “_Gen. A sp. B_” are now stuck with “_Gen. C_” as their community ID. Here’s an example: [Genus Sanguinea from Cruzeiro do Sul - AC, 69980-000, Brasil on September 26, 2020 at 02:13 PM by Alex Oliveira · iNaturalist](https://www.inaturalist.org/observations/61044562#activity_identification_739ea10d-4e05-444e-b3c7-d01c18175063) (there might be more but i can’t remember what they were) I’m not sure if the problem here is the initial conflict caused by the “_Gen. C_” ID after my “_Gen. A sp. B_” ID. Does anyone know why this happens? Also if anyone could bring that observation to species that’d be great! Thanks ---
**Author:** ![matthewvosper](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.inaturalist.org/matthewvosper/32/12194_2.png) [@matthewvosper](https://forum.inaturalist.org/u/matthewvosper)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 12:39pm UTC](https://forum.inaturalist.org/t/observations-stuck-at-genus-level-after-taxon-swap/44797/2 "2023-09-01T12:39:45Z")
The problem here is not with the taxon swap. When a taxon swap happens like the one you describe, IDs at genus level will be bumped up to the new common denominator of Genus A and Genus C. In this case the observation was correctly identified as _Setabis heliodora_ and then a user disagreed, and said it was Genus Sanguinea - writing ‘Sanguinea heliodora’ in a comment. In doing this they were not really disagreeing with the ID - they were really disagreeing with _iNat’s taxonomy_ (at the time). This is what has messed it up. The taxon change then moved Setabis heliodora to Sanguinea. Everything was correct. But because the user said it was _not Setasbis heliodora_, their disagreement now says that it is _not Sanguinea heliodora_ - this has also updated correctly. Tag the user back in with a comment and politely ask them to withdraw their disagreement. ---
**Author:** ![atronoxychump](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.inaturalist.org/atronoxychump/32/9923_2.png) [@atronoxychump](https://forum.inaturalist.org/u/atronoxychump)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 12:58pm UTC](https://forum.inaturalist.org/t/observations-stuck-at-genus-level-after-taxon-swap/44797/3 "2023-09-01T12:58:03Z")
_“In doing this they were not really disagreeing with the ID - they were really disagreeing with iNat’s taxonomy (at the time). This is what has messed it up.”_ Thanks, this is the problem i was alluding to in my statement _“I’m not sure if the problem here is the initial conflict caused by the “Gen. C ” ID after my “Gen. A sp. B ” ID.”_ I find it odd that iNat only looks at what’s the same or what’s different but doesn’t actually look at the reality of the situation - that everyone is _ad idem_ with the ID. It happens quite frequently, unfortunately Why can’t iNat in situations like this ignore the inactive taxon and take only the IDs that have descended from the Genus that the inactive taxon was swapped to (ie. _Sanguinea_), thereby nullifying the original “disagreement”? ---
**Author:** ![cthawley](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.inaturalist.org/cthawley/32/1445_2.png) [@cthawley](https://forum.inaturalist.org/u/cthawley)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 1:04pm UTC](https://forum.inaturalist.org/t/observations-stuck-at-genus-level-after-taxon-swap/44797/4 "2023-09-01T13:04:06Z")
I moved to general because the system is working as intended in this case, but fine to continue Discussion about how iNat works and potential ways to improve it. ---
**Author:** ![matthewvosper](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.inaturalist.org/matthewvosper/32/12194_2.png) [@matthewvosper](https://forum.inaturalist.org/u/matthewvosper)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 1:11pm UTC](https://forum.inaturalist.org/t/observations-stuck-at-genus-level-after-taxon-swap/44797/5 "2023-09-01T13:11:57Z")
I disagree actually. If someone has said it is _not that species_, then if the name changes their disagreement should still stand. A name is not the ‘reality of the situation’, it is just a label. The ‘reality of the situation’ is that if something is ‘not that moth’, then it’s still ‘not that moth’ even if the genus changes. What they should really have done is say ‘yes I agree it _is_ that moth, but I think it should have a different name’ - and then raised a flag against the taxon to suggest a change to the taxonomy. If I disagreed with something, and my disagreement was cancelled just because the name changed, I’d be annoyed (in fact there is an issue where this sometimes happens being discussed on another thread… and people _are_ a tad annoyed, because their work is being undone!). If we use a site like iNat or any other, we have to accept the taxonomy that is currently in place there, even if we think it needs updating or whatever, or problems like this will inevitably result. ---
**Author:** ![atronoxychump](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/user_avatar/forum.inaturalist.org/atronoxychump/32/9923_2.png) [@atronoxychump](https://forum.inaturalist.org/u/atronoxychump)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 2:19pm UTC](https://forum.inaturalist.org/t/observations-stuck-at-genus-level-after-taxon-swap/44797/6 "2023-09-01T14:19:42Z")
That’s a valid point But what i was referring to as the reality of the situation is everyone agreeing as to the exact ID, not the name ---
**Author:** ![system](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex016/uploads/inaturalist/original/2X/7/7831452cf7f0d653ff1ffd34176334b7ef1b6a17.png) [@system](https://forum.inaturalist.org/u/system)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2023, 2:19pm UTC](https://forum.inaturalist.org/t/observations-stuck-at-genus-level-after-taxon-swap/44797/7 "2023-10-31T14:19:44Z")
Closed on October 31, 2023, 2:19pm UTC This topic was automatically closed 60 days after the last reply. New replies are no longer allowed.