"Should Cats be Culled to Stop Extinctions?"

Here’s an interesting new study

“These debates are so divisive,” says Wayne Linklater, an ecologist at the Victoria University of Wellington in New Zealand. Yet “both sides are conservationists. We both care about animals and our relationships with nature.”

… dealing with human dimensions is essential: without buy-in from people responsible for cats, solutions are not likely to be durable … the researchers could then identify interventions that occupied a sweet spot of likely adoption by cat owners, support from vets, and potential for reducing wildlife death.

The highest-rated solution proved to be keeping cats indoors at night—something that’s relatively uncommon in New Zealand, though already routine in many other parts of the world.

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I’m in rural NZ. Where I live it is simple - any cat spotted is shot. If missed, the settlement is notified and we all keep an eye out for it. We may see a cat about once or twice a year - but never the same one as it would have been dealt to quickly.

Same thing goes for dogs - any spotted where it shouldn’t be is shot on sight.

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I definitely think something should be done. I strongly agree that cats should be supervised when outside. After expressing my opinion somewhere outside of iNat, somebody mentioned that they have trained their cats to not kill birds, mammals, or whatever. If this is truly possible, then I absolutely commend it if it works. Even if it is not completely eliminating of the problem, it still lessens it. Actually, one could even both supervise their animals and train them not to kill the native species, which is most logical. It is a shame many people will argue “they’re cats! That’s what they do!” which is true, but ,ompletely pointless, solves nothing, and is nothing but a lame excuse.

Some 40 years ago I had a field assistant while working in Northern Australia. She used to trap and kill cats around Sydney in the national parks and turn their paws into key ring ornaments. I presume the process still goes on since most of the Australian urban areas have bans on cats going outside the owners’ houses unless in a fully enclosed yard (with roof).

We trap cats and hand them to the council. We’ve already lost all lyrebirds on our last property which is presumably down to cats and foxes, both invasive species. Some of the feral cats get very big.

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I totally agree. I think cats should be treated like a pet dog. It should stay on its own property. If the owner cannot get it to stay on its property. Put it on a leash. We have had this conversation on the Next-door App(neighborhood) So many cats are roaming the streets. Some will bring a dead bird to your porch. They have not eaten it. They just had fun taunting it and then killing it. I find cats in Arcadia Trail Park in Ft Worth, TX with collars on hunting in the nature study. These are cats that are well fed so I know this is not due to being hungry.
I think owners should get a warning and a fine if they have a cat that is out and about. Not only that, but why get a pet to leave it to the elements of being hit by a car, killed by a wild animal which we have a few in this area. Possibly poisoned by a person who does not want cats on their property. I hear that goes on in our area.
Maybe stricter fines and having them neutered so they are not breeding like rabbits.
I am not a big fan of feral cats.They do just as much damage. People say they like them on their farms for the mice and rats.
It is a really tough topic all around! An endless battle.:v:t2:

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In the news today- https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-07-15/cats-kill-billions-of-animals-each-year-in-australia/11307684

"The research… revealed each feral cat in the bush would kill about 740 animals per year. Meanwhile, a domesticated cat would kill about 75 animals in a year.

In total, the book’s authors said cats would kill more than 3 million mammals every day, while about 2 million reptiles and 1 million birds would also be killed.

Australia’s mammal extinction rate is by far the highest in the world. “Cats have been a leading cause of at least 20 of our mammal extinctions over the last 200 years”"

Edit to add- these mortaility numbers are of course only refering to the damage done by cats. On top of this, Australian wildlife also faces fox and feral dog predation, not to mention human-caused deaths via landclearing, other habitat loss and anthropogenic climate change. But the cats… the cats we could maybe get a handle on if pet owners would just shape up! Its illegal to own pet rabbits in QLD due the the environmental damage they cause. Things are getting so dire with the cats maybe its time to consider a similar action?

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You’ll never get pet cats outlawed. The best that can be done is to educate people to keep them inside and get them sterilized. Just being realistic.

I don’t know what to do with feral cats. I thought TNR was a good way to deal with them but if there is good evidence that it doesn’t work, I think culling would be reasonable. I love cats and keep several at home but I also love wildlife.

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I read several of the papers on the lack of efficacy of TNR, the diseases spread by cats, their destruction of other species. I understand that for the greater good, lots of feral cats should be killed in order to save the already incredibly stressed ecosystem we have. I understand that, in particular on islands, cats have caused a great deal of damage to the environment, and are directly involved in extinction of at least 63 species. So, I guess all that we can do is mitigate the damage that we have created, by killing this invasive species.

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Humans are a real open book. We range from horrible to wonderful. If there’s anything we should smash it’s the colonial mindset for lack of a better way to describe it but… the fact that humans do awful stuff sometimes doesn’t really lead to saying that for that reason we should also let invasive species we introduced spread and cause extinctions. Doesn’t doing that make humans even worse?
Also this “cull humans” garbage just gives fodder to anti conservation conspiracy theorists. Let’s not go there.

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The problems caused by humans are brought up pretty much every time how to deal with invasive species is discussed in my experience, but what are the intentions of bringing it up? We all know we cause and have caused lots of problems, but there’s nothing significant any of us can do about human overpopulation that I can think of, barring some sort of horrifying genocide/eugenics plan. In Western countries (where the majority of us are from) the populations are either stable or declining. But those same countries are the ones that are doing the most to try protect the nature they have and restore what was destroyed by previous generations. We can contribute to that.
Getting a problem at its source is good, but when the source is yourself, it’s better to try to change yourself than destroy yourself.

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In my experience it’s just an excuse to avoid action they don’t feel like taking by drawing false parallels. At least usually. This isn’t The Avengers and we don’t need to be advocating for genocide here.

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I said there was no other solution than to cull the cats. I am very much against invasive species, furry or otherwise, for I realize the extreme amount of damage that they cause (hello, monocultures).

I am against letting invasive species run wild! I started a project tracking the invasive species in my county (https://www.inaturalist.org/projects/king-county-wa-noxious-and-invasive-weeds). I would NEVER advocate for genocide, against anyone at any time. Full stop.

I apologize for going off-topic. I don’t have cats now, but grew up with them and at times were wonderful friends. I know the culling has to be done, the TNR is largely ineffectual. But I certainly could never be the one to do it. I didn’t like killing the mouse inside of my house, but obviously such things have to be done.

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Your previous comment literally called for culling humans.

To answer the subject-line question: Yes.

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Well, it was flagged by multiple people, and I was advised to edit out any parts that may have been the cause of it being flagged, so I took out the controversial parts.

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Yes. And we should make memorial monuments about them.

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Yes, Thanos’ ridiculous solution would not help. If you halved the world population it would take about 40 years to be back where you started. You would need to address the rate of increase to be effective. The only thing I have seen work (at least statistically) is gender equality. When women are better off they have fewer children.

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I think the issue here is that we’re talking about an animal that is commonly a household pet, with a certain degree of intelligence. Disclaimer: I’m a card-carrying cat-lover who is likely to start talking in baby voices the closer she is to a resident cat, so I am massively biased.

I wonder if the problem is knowledge. I can only speak of the US here, and I know it’s very different in other areas of the world. In my neck of the woods, cats occupy this weird space where they are seen as both valued family pets by some, and farm animals by others. Layered on top of this are a lot of gross misunderstandings of cat behavior, nature, etc.

I was raised being told, when I saw a pet cat or dog kill another animal, ‘that’s just nature’. I came to never to question it, and even thought it was just a part of having a pet. Instead of seeing it as humans affecting nature, it was nature itself, as well as one with a small footprint. ‘It’s just one bird,’ was what I was always told.

This blindness might contribute to the other part, which is people just abandoning pets, not getting their pets neutered if they can, etc. The thinking is that a cat is part of nature, so letting it to fend for itself would just be fine. Same with releasing a goldfish into a pond, or an exotic snake into the swamp.

This is why I feel that culling/relocating cat populations would only work in select areas with natural borders, such as islands, or areas that have no sizeable human populations nearby. Until an area understands the impact, more cats will follow, as well as other pet populations. I also think any talk of culling as a method is also likely to divide people instead of uniting them, in the same way this question would do if someone asked the same of dogs or other beloved pets that have become invasive species in different parts of the world.

The problem is that I don’t have a good answer beyond ‘education’. I do think people’s attitudes are changing, but that’s not a good answer to ‘what can we do for the wildlife we have now’. My scope of how people think about cats is limited to my own experiences in volunteering and living in my area of the US. Also, for me to say it’s just ‘people are dumb’ feels like a nihilistic, extremely simplified approach.

The big takeaway I can offer is that the only reason I even began to strongly change how cats were handled in my own household is because of people getting the message out years ago. In turn, I try to pass on the message, but it gets difficult, especially when people mistake it as me being an extremely protective cat-lover.

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Managing and reducing the population of invasive species is not only a necesity, but an obligation. Most of the animals that are wrecking havoc on native ecosystems were brought there by us humans. Therefore, it is our responsibility to fix the issue as best as we can.
I also believe the huge backlash that culling generates is not only 'cause this is about species we are fond of (as mentioned before, most people don’t care about rat eradication for example) but also due to most people not understanding what ecological management entails. Folks love the “nice” side of conservation, but don’t understand that conservation also means culling sometimes (specially considering we have had a big role in getting rid of medium/big carnivores that could manage said species for us).Lots of people nowadays are disconected from nature, so it’s way harder for them to understand and support certain conservation methods and they see them as cruel and inhumane (I should know, I used to be one of those people). I believe that if we start teaching that we as human are part of nature and that we have a rol to do in preserving the ecosystems and fixing our past mistakes, then we won’t have as many troubles with invasives moving forward, cause there will be swifter and more succesful action taken when a species is accidentaly introduced.

So I wholeheartedly support killing invasive species, even if they are cute looking. I think they deserve respect however (specially cause they have managed to thrive in a foreign enviroment), so they should be dispached as quickly and as painlessly as possible.

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On that note, whenever I hear someone repeating back the standard anti-cat narrative about endangered birds, I want to ask them: which endangered birds live in your neighborhood? Considering that most endangered birds are habitat specialists, endangered by habitat loss, I would venture to say that the presence of the neighborhood itself is a bigger danger to them than the cats in it.

But just try selling any city council on the idea of halting development. Cat eradication is an easier sell. That’s the bottom line as I see it.

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