One type of public land that is restricted that I didn’t notice in the thread is land that is public but restricted to protect an endangered species or ecosystem that often doesn’t show up on maps because no one wants attention brought to it. We have a few of those in the Columbia River Gorge for instance to protect the endangered western pond turtle, or a nesting pair of peregrines, or a particular wetland.
3 Likes
In Massachusetts we have this problem largely with access to the shoreline/intertidal, which is public land. There’s a lawsuit pending right now by a landowner to try to eliminate a public right of way that’s the only access to one of the best vantages in New England for sea-watching.
2 Likes
If there are assigned public entrances, sure, but I cannot see any reason to block access to a public patch of land. Seems the local town/city/county needs to make allowances for entry to accommodate visitors AND landowners. They know that land is public and people want to access it and landowners shouldn’t be surprised that people try to use a pathway if it exists. I see public land trust properties all around and there are often pathways that run right between private homes. Access is restricted at night, but the homeowners are perfectly fine with people using the paths during the day. As long as the visitors respect the property on either side and stick to the trail, there shouldn’t be any reason to be a jerk to the public.
WMA’s are great because the hunting season tends not to overlap the prime naturalizing season, and there are usually no restrictions to collecting or lighting after dark. I hardly ever see people in WMA’s in the offseason for hunting.
1 Like
Yes, I saw this article and, being in California, it greatly irritated me. I believe England has rites to wander across private lands, and we need the same in the US at least to get to public lands.
2 Likes
So you’d be ok with everyone cutting across your yard to get to the park?
1 Like
In England it is existing historical right of way.
When you buy the land you know the right of way exists.
Similar to a servitude for water / power / sewage / whatever.
3 Likes
Wandering and using a ROW don’t sound the same to me.
If you listen to the BBC, you will understand that there are pros and cons to their wander laws. However, it appears that farmers are more or less OK with people crossing their lands if the people are respectful, close gates, do not liter, do not wander the planted fields and get in the way of ongoing work, and stay on the developed trails. With respect to your comment, yes, I would mind because the park has open access. That is not what is being discussed here. And maybe I am not using the exact correct phrasing. In some places it is a right of passage on old established trails, in others, it is a truly a right to wander. In all cases, respect for the owner and what he/she is using the land for, as well as general respect for the land and nature, is needed by the user.
4 Likes
The rule exists mostly for use of old Roman-age paths and roads. If I ever got a big part of land, I won’t have people roaming on it, especially as we all know people rarely just walk, they start campfires, gather plants or mushrooms, etc.
For clarity, I’m not saying that property owners aren’t blocking legal access in some places. They are. That should be challenged.
But some of those maps displayed look like parcels far from public roads and generally never had a public access and I’ve never heard of right to wander in the US. I would not expect surrounding landowners to permit public access across their lands or roads that they have deeded access without compensation. And some may also choose not to sell. The state may (laws vary) condemn a ROW if they view it in the public interest but that’s a decision of the land manager. Then a judge decides the compensation but you have to sell.
My experiences with user behavior tells me that enough don’t have respect. It doesn’t take many.
As far as I know, which may not be far enough, in the U.S. people must be allowed access to land they own. For a BLM parcel surrounded by private land, that means somebody (and I can imagine lawsuits over who) must allow BLM personnel and those doing authorized work for the BLM to get to and from the property. That doesn’t necessarily mean complete public access (another reason for lawsuits, maybe).
The word some of you are looking for is “easement.” Most properties have easements through them or along the margins for roads, powerlines, sewer lines, gas pipelines, railroads, etc. Entry along the easements is for the people/organizations who have the easement, for the purpose of the easement, not for everyone or every reason.
7 Likes
Here is a little more information. The current right to roam laws in England go beyond the use of historical paths.
https://www.gov.uk/right-of-way-open-access-land/use-your-right-to-roam
2 Likes
This is an interesting topic for my area of South Florida in the US. I live in the suburbs surrounding Miami and so there really aren’t any natural public lands remaining in general due to the rapid development of the area. The high population here means that natural areas open to the public are often trashed among other things. I have explored on google maps a bit around my area, and there are some places that appear as “public” on google maps but are in fact closed to the public. However, many times it seems that it is county property and is closed because it is a preserve or otherwise protected (at least I think so), which I certainly don’t mind! For example:
This “Tamiami Pinelands” preserve is inaccessible to the public despite google maps showing otherwise. https://www.google.com/maps/place/Tamiami+Pinelands/@25.6489639,-80.4061003,1602m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m6!3m5!1s0x88d9c1747be92c77:0x4c2c5f7422eac977!8m2!3d25.6504221!4d-80.4055263!16s%2Fg%2F1tdh97k3
I do prefer it be a protected area than private property owners sort of “claiming” or fencing public lands. The thing is the high development and tourism means that having a large property at all is incredibly expensive, and most property lines are very well-defined. I’m sure this sort of thing is more likely to happen near the less developed areas and agricultural lands bordering the Everglades. I really can’t complain about natural areas being inaccessible though because I have the Biscayne national park, Everglades national park, and Big Cypress National preserve all under an hour’s drive away!
2 Likes
Ignore the bullet hole…? in the sign.
It’s a two-edged sword for sure.
Around southern New Mexico, USA, there are immense tracts of public land, immense military reservations, and some closed tracts of research lands (e.g. the Jornada Experimental Range, and various NMSU (university) plots).
Some areas which are open to the public and are accessible have become de-facto RV playgrounds, trash dumps, and shooting grounds. Typically the trash dumped out in the desert becomes the target for the shooters. The result is a landscape of rutted two-tracks and discarded TV sets shot full of holes, where the ground glitters with broken glass and shell casings.
So out here, easy public access comes with the danger of thoughtless degradation.
On the other hand, there are exceptionally rugged areas where the ATVs can’t go, and those are mostly pristine – especially if they’re too rugged even for the range cattle which are allowed to infest most public lands in the American West. Of course, such places are not an easy stroll for the naturalist either.
And there are some well-protected natural areas, though fewer than one might guess. White Sands National Park is clean, but areas of the Organ Mountain Desert Peaks National Monument are open to RVs and cattle, and the Lincoln National Forest doubles as a National Cow Dung Repository.
Yes, I get bitter sometimes.
But to the topic: Out here, some people – myself included – will roll under a BLM barbed-wire fence or slip across a stretch of NMSU land to get to an interesting publicly-owned area. But this is on unfrequented lands where nobody is watching and, probably, nobody really cares.
I don’t encourage others to trespass. But I regard trespassing with a light foot as insignificant compared to the harms done by motor vehicles and trash-dumpers. And cows.
12 Likes
This topic was automatically closed 60 days after the last reply. New replies are no longer allowed.